Rum+Cigar.mmmmm!

[KINGSTON]

What are some of your guys, Perfect Rum & Cigar pairings?

[Matusalem]

I have not been as active lately. A couple of enjoyable combinations in recent months included the cheaper Plantation Barbados coupled with a Bolivar Gold Medal (new release), Clement VSOP with an ERdM Choix Supreme and Depaz with a Le Hoyo du Prince.

[cigar-aficionado]

Ron Zacapa and BBF, the sweetness of the rum offsets the stregnth of the Bolivar wonderfully:D

[Hank Koestner]

I may have posted some of these in other threads, so if I repeat myself, I apologize.

Padilla 1932.................Ron Zacapa 23, Angostura 1824
Padron 1964................Vizcaya
Tatuaje Cabinet Noella...Plantation Jamaican 8
Coronado by La Flor......Eldorado 15, Appleton 12
CAO Cameroon.............Neisson Rhum Agricole Blanc
Cohiba Siglo VI.............Neisson Rhum Agricole XO
La Flor Dominicana Chisel Natural...Ron Centennario Fundacion XX, Eldorado 15
La Flor Chisel Maduro...Mount Gay XO
Cusano Cuvee Grand....Neisson Rhum Agricole XO
La Aurora 100 Anos......Ron Centennario XX, El Dorado 15
Ashton Virgin Sun Grown..Havana Club 7
Montecristo Edmundo.....El Dorado 15, HC Barrelproof
Partagas SD4................Eldorado 12, Appleton 12, Mount Gay XO

[KINGSTON]

Tatuaje w/ For de Cana
CAO Brazilia w/ Cruzan Single Barrel
Graycliff Original w/ 10 Cane

[tym2relax]

Tatuaje w/ For de Cana
CAO Brazilia w/ Cruzan Single Barrel
Graycliff Original w/ 10 Cane

Curious, which Tatuaje and which Flor de Cana?

[KINGSTON]

Tatuaje Red Label, Flor de Cana Black Label 5yr.

[Don Piero]

Just had a Por Laranaga Lonsdale (German Regional Edition) with an El Dorado 15yo. Whoever suggested the the El Dorado with a cigar is a bleepin genius. The tobacco flavour exploded with this rum. Great cigar, complimented with a great rum. Better than any scotch, cognac or port pairing. I'm shocked at how good this rum was with a cigar. :)

[Lew Barrett]

I've been experimenting a lot recently as I've been expanding my NC horizon. I just had a Perdomo Lot 23 robusto with 1796. This was my first Perdomo, and like many other of my recent acquisitions, it shows need for box time. Easy light, perfect construction and burn, dark gray ash, but took time to develop flavor as well as power. The 1796 was superb, and while the cigar was good and has fine potential, like so many of my newly acquired Nics it is showing more muscle than finesse. I think ST 1796 has superb cigar potential, with a lot of the things I like in cigar rum. Sweet, complex, smooth and that distinct ability to stand up to the power of a decent stick.

I get the sense that some of these vitolas are very well made of perfectly fine leaf, but are needing just a bit more age on them. I am encouraged though, as my experiments have been much more satisfying and promising than the ones that drove me from NCs ten years ago. Overall, I continue to find excellent quality coming out of Nicaragua. And I hear you about the Tats, Hank.
A DP Blue Generoso I had Saturday was superb, fully the equal of a mid level CC in my opinion. Tomorrow night, if the weather is nice, I'll stop screwing around and break out something special, say one of my carefully horded Sig IVs. It's great to be able to smoke regularly again after the winter hiatus up here. By way of explanation, my wife tolerates almost all of my errant behavior but has little to no tolerance of gars in the house. I have to smoke on the boat or hide in the garage in the winter, and that discourages frequent indulgence. Hooray for summer in the Northern Hemisphere!

[tym2relax]

http://www.idatasoft.com/olivaV.jpg

[Lew Barrett]

Lovely image.

I'm aging my Vs for a bit, but hitting the Gs pretty hard.
Did some Cbid work this week, and picked up some Padillas, and a slew of various Pepins. They had a 20 piece sampler for $49 that I bought into....twice!

[tym2relax]

My neighbor brought over the V Figurado and I was not overly impressed. We had more fun with the Pampero! My friend could not believe a rum could be so good. Deeeelicious!

I have some double robustos in the cooler and will leave them there awhile...

Lew, nice haul from Cbid. http://www.clubstogie.com/vb/images_cs3/smilies/smoke.gif

[Lew Barrett]

I should have a handsome package arriving in the next few days! My humidor doth overflow!

[Don Piero]

I should have a handsome package arriving in the next few days! My humidor doth overflow!

If you have a lot of cigars, maybe its time to store in a cooler with a good seal or get a wine cooler (but don't plug it in) with some beads. I have a wine cooler that allows me to store several whole boxes.

[tym2relax]

If you have a lot of cigars, maybe its time to store in a cooler with a good seal or get a wine cooler (but don't plug it in) with some beads. I have a wine cooler that allows me to store several whole boxes.

Soon, that's where I will be heading. Wine cooler time. Here is LA we get up into the 90's once in awhile and I am running out of room in the humidor and cooler. Will be nice to have everything in one protected cave.

[Lew Barrett]

If you have a lot of cigars, maybe its time to store in a cooler with a good seal or get a wine cooler (but don't plug it in) with some beads. I have a wine cooler that allows me to store several whole boxes.

I have several storage modes, or areas if you will. I have a cedar lined closet in my basement that is my summer storage area for important vitolas. A bit of water in a pan on the floor keeps humidity remarkably stable, and the temperature doesn't rise above 72 degrees on even the hottest days. In winter, it's a bit too cold for cigars I want to smoke immediately, so they get moved back upstairs. My main house storage is in a purpose built chest/end table humidor of about 5 cubic feet. It has no temperature control, but serves for Nicaraguan, Honduran and the few Dominicans I might have in summer, though the same can't be said for cigars of other provinance. I have never had bug problems with the usual run of cigars I keep there in summer, although this chest can rise briefly to dangerous levels in the warm season. I have several 100 cigar humidors for loose cigars at my office and on the boat. Those areas are either air conditioned, or as in the case of the boat, almost never rise above the mid 70s. What can I say? I juggle them!

[Hank Koestner]

Last year I finally purchased one large end table type humidor that holds 1200 cigars, but I have 300- 400 in there at any one time. 2 shelves and a top drawer. I have many singles, so I found cedar trays with dividers to place them all in. I use 2 Oasis XL humidifiers, one kicks in if the other is out of fluid. In my town house apartment, the temp is constant anywhere, even in the closets, at what I set the AC to. That is my only drawback, the temp stays at 73-74. There is no place cooler to put them, and my wine cooler is full of wine. I set the humidifiers at 68, which keeps the humidity about 66. I have 2 digital hygrometers, but I think they are off a point or 2, because they read 64 to 66, and my electric oasis are set to 68. They stay at 65 to 67 even if my oasis is up to 70, which is too much. I would prefer to know for sure that the humidity was at 66 to 67. All my smokes do smoke beautifully though, and they all look great, with a slight sheen of oil.

[Don Piero]

I use a mix of both the 65% and 70% heartfelt beads in the wine cooler with the humidity being about 65-67% which to me is ideal. I have a small desktop that I keep my NC's in and have it at about 70% humidity. The temperature ranges from 70-72degrees

[tym2relax]

I've been using 65% beads for years bur will probably move towards a active system like the Hydra soon. The beads are slow to recover and require more attention then I like. The only possible problem I see with the active system is mold (in the canister). Have you had any problems with your Oasis Hank?

Over the weekend I picked up my first bottle of ED 15 :D. $30 for a gift pack that included two glasses! Sat night I tried it with a Illusion cg4 and was taken aback by the greatness of this rum. Wow, this is good, really good.

I also picked up some Appleton Extra and Senior Curacao for a little Mai Tai fun. I think I am going to experiment with 1 oz ea of the Extra and the ED 15.

As far as cigar rums I now have the Zaya, Barcelo Imperial, Pampero and ED 15. If anyone has a suggestion on what I should try next I am ready.

[Lew Barrett]

I now reserve ED 15 exclusively for "cigar work." The entire Zacapa family of rums is good with gars, I think, depending on the stick. Vizcaya or Ango 1919 might be interesting ones for you to try. Both are quite different from each other, but sort of like cigars all by their lonesomes. I don't know if this is good or bad for pairing, tasting like a cigar, but to me, both Vizcaya and 1919 have certain tobacco notes. SR 1796 and Ron Centenario XX are other easy recommendations, both being viscous, sweet, fruity and rich.

Soon our master-matcher, HK, will come along to make his suggestions and they'll be based on broad experience. I have yet to find a happy pairing of cigars with Agricoles, but I only have one true agricole, as I seem to favor the dark industrials for cigars in general.

[Matusalem]

I've been using 65% beads for years bur will probably move towards a active system like the Hydra soon. The beads are slow to recover and require more attention then I like. The only possible problem I see with the active system is mold (in the canister). Have you had any problems with your Oasis Hank?Not to discourage from the Oasis at all...

"The beads are slow to recover and require more attention then I like"

Actually I believe slow is the best application for cigars. Same concept as tugging on them too quickly / strongly when lit. Same concept as final results in accelerated attempts at aging / smokability etc.

As far as fluctuation, it should be gradual - rapid back and forth can crack wrappers, make the filler more brittle or damp and spongy... and isn't considered the best or ideal for considerable maturation.

You've probably heard warning that it's better to just remain slightly over-weight than to have one of those Oprah Winfrey, Luther Vandross type love and hate affairs with food... whereas you're up and down like the stock market or an elevator? In theory I believe the same is the case with cigars. Like everything else they expand and contract with changes. Too rapid and excessive changes ...well you get the picture.

I don't use beads but understand one angle to look at if you are having problems - you'd probably want to increase the portion of beads to the space you are using them in.

You might also explore the space itself to ensure it isn't a seal issue or allowing outside atmosphere to enter. I'm thinking the more beads you put the longer the time between or slower the fluctuations should be (reducing attention - no?).

Just some thoughts.

[tym2relax]

Interesting points Matusalem. I'll have to think about that.

[Matusalem]

Also you guys exploring storage issues - might consider large regular coolers (not refrigerated wine coolers). The capacity and prices are generally quite a bit more favorable. A Coleman 200 qt cooler - obviously depending on actual box dimensions - should hold 50 cigar boxes.

[cigar-aficionado]

I wish we had the warm weather here in the UK to necessitate getting a wine cooler for our cigars:mad: Lots of good points made here though about storage and pairing cigars...I still reckon the Cuban rums are right up there with the best for pairing;)

[Hank Koestner]

Hello my friends, very busy these week, and i do have some comments to add to the discussion, but need more time. I am glad that many of you are enjoying ED 15 with your cigars. Back later for more talk!

[tym2relax]

Also you guys exploring storage issues - might consider large regular coolers (not refrigerated wine coolers). The capacity and prices are generally quite a bit more favorable. A Coleman 200 qt cooler - obviously depending on actual box dimensions - should hold 50 cigar boxes.

I am using a cooler and humidor but the indoor temperature here can get into the high 80's at times. Even though we are near the beach (south LA) it can get hot and we do not have air conditioning. Most homes here don't. This is where a wine cooler makes sense to me.

[Matusalem]

I am using a cooler and humidor but the indoor temperature here can get into the high 80's at times. Even though we are near the beach (south LA) it can get hot and we do not have air conditioning. Most homes here don't. This is where a wine cooler makes sense to me.If you can't avoid it at all then a cooling unit is a must. In the summer my indoor temp reaches +80, but I try to make sure the closet space I use for my coolers / desktops etc. doesn't exceed 70 degrees.

For me... amazing what one or two very small blocks of dried ice can do in a moderate size closet. When we have weeks on end of 90+ I put dried ice in the closet in a bucket... get home the closet is cool... late in the evening put the dried ice back in the freezer and next morning repeat... til the weather calms down.

Are you in an apartment or house? If a home - you'd want the lowest position in the house, darkest space, a basement or closet nowhere near anything conducting heat to put your coolers etc. Closets under stairways seem to often be cool-er in my own experience.

Anyway... not to talk you out of your potential wine cooler. I'm just a cheap bastard - can you tell?:p

[tym2relax]

Yes, it's a house that has no 'cool' spots. I have a cooler on the third floor and a humidor on the second. Both can get toasty. I like your idea of dry ice, very clever. I can just imagine my wifes expression bringing a pail of dry ice into our closet. :eek:

There are bargains to be found on wine coolers if you don't mind buying a scratch and dent model. I would keep it in the garage anyway.

[orangecrusher13]

I have used coolers for many years for bulk storage of my cigars. I feed my humidors from the coolers.

I used them to haul my stash to Panama when I moved here a couple years ago. I have found them to be an excellent and effective cheap storage device. They are tight enough to retain the ambient humidity and temperature, and help greatly to even out flucuations.

All together, I moved 9 45 quart Rubbermaid coolers full of boxes of cigars. I also use 65% beads to further moderate changes in humidity and temp.

I was really worried when I moved that my sticks would get damaged, primarily from heat since they would have to spend over 3 weeks packed away in a 40 foot shipping container in the middle of August. I am happy to say I had absolutely no problems, no beetle hatch, and they arrived in fine shape.

Fortunately where I am located in Panama, at about 4500 feet, the temperature is pretty constant year round at about 65F to 75F, but the RH in the wet season is usually above 80% all the time. I dehumidify the house down to about 65% during the estacion lluviosa. The temp in the house is always around 70F.

For what its worth, my opinion is that cigars are much hardier than you might think. I try and take care of them as best I can, but I am surprised how tolerant they really are to reasonable fluctuation.

I think I get more damaged wrappers from fondling them than from changes in storage. Yes, I have the rare cracked wrapper, but most of the time they smoke just fine.

[Lew Barrett]

As we all know, it's possible to repair even beetle damaged cigars if one is reasonably vigilant and gets to them in time. And I agree that it is possible to restore dry cigars to good flavor and smoke-ability with patience and an understanding of how to care for the wrappers....don't re-humidify them too fast. In fact, as most have discovered, cigars are usually better slightly on the drier side rather than the wet side, if one must choose, especially as they are subject to mold when too wet, whereas they just crystalize their oils if too dry.

Playing with one's cigars:D Freud would have a field day!!!

[Matusalem]

whereas they just crystalize their oils if too dry.Not sure about dry but this phenomenon is prevalent in temperature change. Cigars can plume or bloom (as some refer to it as) fairly rapidly when exposed to sudden changes.

From what was theorized, the changes happen at a rate that the oil can't retract back in and remains trapped outside the wrapper surface crystallized.

[Lew Barrett]

Not sure about dry but this phenomenon is prevalent in temperature change. Cigars can plume or bloom (as some refer to it as) fairly rapidly when exposed to sudden changes.

From what was theorized, the changes happen at a rate that the oil can't retract back in and remains trapped outside the wrapper surface crystallized.

I have no great store of theoretical knowledge about cigars, nor have I done much by way of practiced study, but I have smoked my share, and some of yours too!

Therefore I'll buy your explanation without further ado, but I always assumed through observation that bloom was simply a result of the oils crystalizing on the wrapper's surface probably as a result of drying. Yet I'm happy to increase my cigar lore with your added knowledge!

[Matusalem]

Therefore I'll buy your explanation without further ado, but I always assumed through observation that bloom was simply a result of the oils crystalizing on the wrapper's surface probably as a result of drying. Yet I'm happy to increase my cigar lore with your added knowledge!Not my theory but some of it came from someone very notable in Cuban cigar intelligence.

To be clear, I don't think drying is totally unrelated - it would indeed seem that there is a moisture recession but at a pace that leaves the oil behind and unable to recede.

I buy into the theory from personal experience on multiple levels as I tend to see quite a bit more bloom during colder winter days, particularly when exchanging cigars or simply seeing them taken somewhere from a warm(er) environment into the cold(er) environment.

The other times I've seen it in unusual amounts is from cooling my space down as described above. The cooler air seems to trap and isolate the oil on the surface.

I'm guessing but believe if you set out to actually create plume/bloom you'd probably have better success if your manipulation is directed towards temp.
as opposed to simply "drying".

I can just imagine my wifes expression bringing a pail of dry ice into our closet. :eek:LOL. Wives, can't live without em' can we? I'd tell you about mine... but you already have one - therefore you already know!:) Just a joke - definitely don't want to offend any of my rum Goddesses! As I said: "can't live without em'".

To be clearer, I'm using a couple of those tubed dried ice containers... they look like a very small ratchet tool set case/box type thing... size-wise maybe like a briefcase for a dwarf or doll?

The bucket (empty Bryers ice cream half gallon bucket) is to catch any condensation... just in case you thought I was buying raw dried ice from some company in a 5 gallon paint bucket and racing home with fog pouring out of my car and closet... :p

I just throw the things in the freezer by night when it's cooler and put em back in the bucket in the AM in the closet while it's still somewhat cool before I leave for work or other activities.

[Hank Koestner]

I will go back to Lew's earlier post about pairings. I think I just have experimented quite a bit, and have more experiences with the occasional good or great pairing, and mostly mediocre and bad ones. As you look through the different threads, you can see many examples of what I have tried and liked and disliked. And, as Matusalem has mentioned before, I sometimes revisit a great pairing only to have it not be as good as the first time, at least that night anyway. Something I like, another may think is terrible.
I have had a hard time with 1919, it does not hold up to a complex cigar, medium or full, IMHO. Vizcaya on the other hand will be great with the right mild to medium cigar, but with a full bodied cigar, the Vizcaya's subtle nuances are lost, and that is what makes it a good rum. It is the same reason why I told people at the tasting that I don't think the rum should be mixed, it gets lost. All the experimentation is what makes it fun. One recommendation: always start off with a small pour, so if the pairing is not very good to you, you can change easily.
As far as agricoles go, think of pairing them as you would a cognac or scotch with a cigar. You might find more good pairings in this manner with agricoles.

As far as bloom goes, I have a little on some of the cigars that have been in the humi for a good while. I have never seen any sudden outbreaks of bloom, though. I think my numbers stay pretty constant in the humi.